Matthew Weitzel: 0:07

Celebrating 10 years of trailblazing in ground support Xcēd marks a decade as your leading partner in ground support equipment leasing at the forefront of both short term and long term leasing solutions. Xcēd adapts to your unique operational needs. Whether you're ramping up for peak season or planning for long term growth, we provide the right equipment to keep your operations running smoothly. This anniversary, we renew our dedication to empowering your ground operations with efficiency and innovation. With Xcēd, you're equipped for success today and prepare for the challenges of tomorrow. Xcēd driving excellence on the ground year after year. Explore more at xcedgse.com

Unknown: 0:56

this is Laura McGrath, this is Jennifer Madison. This is Sophie Skinner Jones, and you're listening to the GSE podcast.

Matthew Weitzel: 1:05

All right, welcome to the GSE Podcast. I'm Matt Weitzel, and I'm here with Jesse long from lektro. How's it going? Jesse, yeah,

Unknown: 1:13

going real good,

Matthew Weitzel: 1:13

yeah, man. So you all just had some meetings here in the Orlando area, so I guess Oshkosh came down to have some meetings, yeah? So

Unknown: 1:22

we're still in the early integration phase of the transition, right? And it's just a good opportunity for the Aerotech leadership to interact with Oshkosh leadership a little bit and really comparing cultures and a lot of similarities. Of course, we're all continuing to learn, which is encouraging. I think we're all headed the same direction and really excited about what the future holds.

Matthew Weitzel: 1:41

Yeah, Oshkosh is a huge organization, and we're here today, though, to talk about Lektro so can you kind of give me a brief overview of how you got started in the industry? Yeah, that's

Unknown: 1:54

interesting, and I'll try not to make it too long, but I actually had zero business background, zero aviation background. It was actually a family friend, Eric Paulson, who previously owned Lektro. So I started working for Lektro when they were privately held as kind of family owned small company had grown out of the general aviation segment, well, continuing to serve the general aviation segment, but had expanded to the commercial aviation segment, right? And, yeah, he just asked one day if, when I finished college, I was interested in a job. So I started out doing domestic sales, and I've kind of progressed up and now serving in the Oshkosh organization as the Global Director of Lektro product and general aviation sales. Oh, okay, so

Matthew Weitzel: 2:41

Eric started the company when it

Unknown: 2:44

was actually Eric's father, Wilt Paulson, who started the company in 1945 Wow, yeah, I didn't know that. Yeah, that's crazy. And Eric actually took a leave of absence when he was in university, 1819, years old. His father was starting to get a little bit older, and the company was struggling a little bit. His dad was really an inventor and not as much of a businessman. So he came up with a lot of great ideas, but not all of them extremely marketable or with high demand. And so Eric took that leave of absence from university. Never went back, ended up running the company, basically from the time he was about 19 years old. Ended up purchasing it from his father, so his father could retire in the, I think it was the mid to late 80s. And then really was focusing on the aircraft tow tractor. So Lektro had done a diversity of different types of equipment up until the tow tractor, or the aircraft tow tractor, was first built, the first one, in 1967 and then that ended up being the focus of the company, you know, with Eric at the helm, as just being a product that really nobody else was doing, we were the first in that segment to do Tobar, listen electric, but also something that really had high demand, had very, very high customer satisfaction ranking. So any analyst that looked at it said, You need to stop competing in the forklift market, which we had for a while in the golf cart market, the materials handling type things, and really focus on this, where you have high, high customer satisfaction and very minimal competition. So

Matthew Weitzel: 4:10

you're friends with Eric, or Eric knows your family. Or, like, how did that? How'd that work? Like, I guess you know he asked you after college, but then, how did you get to know him?

Unknown: 4:19

Yeah, so he was actually friends with my brother. It was actually through a church group connection, okay? And then he he met me. My brother was already, you know, gainfully employed and all that, yeah. And he said, Oh, Luke's got a brother, and maybe, maybe I can get him. So he issued an invitation, and here we are.

Matthew Weitzel: 4:39

Oh, man, that's crazy. So the one thing that I do remember from the GSE expos, or whatever they used to be called, was that Eric would, wouldn't he drive some huge RV? Yeah.

Unknown: 4:49

So we've taken a couple different marketing approaches, but one thing that Eric always focused on very strongly was customer relationships, and they were not just superficial relationships. I mean, he was very intentional, intentional about, yeah, developing relationships with people. And so we would go to trade shows, and he'd bring his his bus and serve food and drinks out of them, and it was really a hospitality center where he could just hang out with his friends. I mean, they were his friends in the industry. Yeah,

Matthew Weitzel: 5:17

that was, like a staple of all the shows. Was him pulling up with that bus. And it was just, it was crazy, yeah, yeah, yeah. So those were, those are the good old days. Well, yeah, and I think there's more to come, yeah. Oh, good. That's awesome. Well, good to hear. So, so basically, you start with them in the 2000s

Unknown: 5:35

Yeah, I was first hired in 2005 okay, and

Matthew Weitzel: 5:38

then what did the product line look like at that point.

Unknown: 5:41

Yeah. So we had our 89 series tractors already at that time, but they were in their fairly early ages of infancy. We were still pursuing Boeing and Airbus approvals. We had focused pretty strongly with our smaller tractors for the commercial airlines, and hadn't really moved up to the 737, 757, and Airbus. You know that 318, to 321, families of aircraft. So when I came on and really starting in 2011 2012 my mission was to take as much off of Eric's shoulders as I could from essentially business or general aviation business or activity, and allow him to focus on those additional OEM approvals, or the ntos from Boeing and Airbus, and then marketing this new big, narrow body tractor to our airline customers. And that was he, what he just jumped into then, from that time going forward, and really getting Demo units out to, you know, the major customers here domestically, winning their trust and starting to sell, and that's when the business really started growing, 2015 and beyond.

Matthew Weitzel: 6:51

Okay, so you started out in general aviation, like, that's where the the product really kind of got its foothold,

Unknown: 6:57

exactly. Yeah. So in 1967 when the first Lektro was built. It was for an FBO operator in the Portland area, okay, who basically said, why do we put this bar in between the tow tractor and the aircraft? It just introduced an extra pivot point. It doesn't use the weight of the aircraft to your advantage. You're basically competing against it with the weight of your tow tractor. And especially as you handle larger aircraft, you have to have a larger and larger, heavier and heavier tow tractor to compete against that weight and inertia, right? So they were saying, eliminate the pivot point, use the aircraft weight to your advantage and just simplify the whole process. And it's really interesting the history of lektro and Eric's dad being such a creative kind of ahead of his time. I mean, you even look at that Lektro logo, which has been in use now for decades and decades and decades, I think it's still an awesome logo, yes, and yet it's timeless, almost. I mean, from when it first started being used to today, and that was really how wilt and his ideas were. I mean, being the first one to build an electric golf cart. Back in those days, when he built an electric golf cart, a lot of courses wouldn't even let you drive something on their golf course. They wanted everybody walking. You know, it was the good old days. That's how you play golf. And why would you drive a cart on my course? And now you'll be hard pressed to find a course that lets you walk. Yeah, right. So he's really been ahead of his time in a lot of ways, just driving these different changes when he introduced this tow barless tractor. Now, after it was developed with that FBO operator in the Portland area. Now he's taking these units around to other FBOs, and they're saying, you know, it's typical aviation industry mentality, you know, we've never done it that way. This is kind of new, we're not really sure. And he would just drop off a unit and say, well, use it for a couple weeks or a month, and I'll come back and pick it up. And when he comes back to pick it up, they're pulling out their checkbook saying, What do I got to pay to keep this thing? You know, because just the efficiency of an electric solution, of a tow bar list solution, and it's so universal, you know, you don't have the myriad of tow bars and all

Matthew Weitzel: 9:01

that. So yeah, and then the turning radius, right? And being able to kind of stack a hanger, I think, is, like, a huge thing for Lektro Correct?

Unknown: 9:09

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. I mean, we're just real strong both in, in and out of the hangar, and that's really what's unique, yeah, yeah.

Matthew Weitzel: 9:15

So then, how did you get into the commercial airlines? Was it through those shows, you know, through those big Expo shows that you all were able to kind of break in, and they were actually coming to

Unknown: 9:24

you? Yeah. So I should know that history a little bit better. My understanding is that the airlines actually started coming, some of the regional carriers, to the general aviation shows, and saying how, you know, because some of the airframes, if you look at the CRJ series or the erjs, they have general aviation configurations right to be business jets, and then they also have their commercial configuration. So these regional carriers were coming to the shows saying, how are the business aviation operators handling these aircraft? Is there a better, more efficient way? And that's when they saw our product. So initially we were selling a lot of the 87 10s and 88 to these regional carriers for their ERJ and CRJs. And then from that point, you know, it was basically them asking, can we expand the range now to handle as the RJs size increase? Can we accommodate it? And then also, you know, with the narrow body, single aisle Boeing and Airbus fleet? So, yeah, it was interesting. It's just one of those things. As customers use a quality product and recognize it and see the value that it brings to their business. Demand kind of naturally follows, yeah, for sure. Can

Matthew Weitzel: 10:32

you kind of run through the series with me? Like, as far as like, is it started to 86 No.

Unknown: 10:38

So we've, in more recent years, kind of brought back even a smaller model, which is Lektro 83 Oh, wow. And that's for your trainer aircraft, the real small. It'll handle up to a King Air in the business aviation side handle your small Lears and citations. Then the Lektro 86 as what a lot of people are most familiar with was a big, big seller. It seems to be kind of tapering down a little bit more leveling out as business jets just get bigger. You know, people are wanting to buy a tractor that maybe not only handles what they're flying today, but what they're going to fly 10 years from now. Yeah. So with the 86 will basically handle up to the larger citations, some of the hawkers that I guess you don't see quite as much these days, the Lektro 87 model is where you start having crossover. It's applicable both in the general aviation segment as well as the commercial, commercial aviation segment, where you can handle your CRJs and ERJ. On the general aviation side, it's the smaller golf streams and Falcon jets by dasso. The Lektro 88 series is really a bread and butter for us for the last decade, really, just because it's still low profile enough to fit underneath the low nose landing gear doors of your small business jets, your liars and citations you can handle King airs. I mean, even some of the small Cessna trainer aircraft all the way up through the Embraer 170 to 195 okay,

Matthew Weitzel: 12:03

so if you have the ADA, you can pretty much handle anything that might come in, especially

Unknown: 12:08

as an FBO operator, yeah, and in the general aviation, we still have a lot of customers buying that for their stations that don't need to handle anything larger than an Embraer 195 okay, as soon as You move into the airliner like Boeing and Airbus, you really need to move to the 89 but that's what's so unique about the Lektro product line, where basically the larger you get, and this isn't always true, but by and large, the larger tractor can handle not only its full capacity, but almost everything smaller. And that's what made the introduction of the Lektro 89 into the market so revolutionary is it was really the first tractor of its kind that was fully approved by the aircraft manufacturers to handle everything from a Boeing 757 all the way down through the seven threes, the A 320s the Embraer 170 to 195 the CRJs, even the ERJ 135 and 145 and nobody had something like that. So you have customers now who, who essentially will have a narrow body terminal, right? And they can just go from gate to gate. And it doesn't matter if it's an ERJ 135 you pull up, push it back. If it's a 757, pull up, push it back. And you're not searching for tow bars. You're not trying to figure out what tractor I need to use, or anything like that. And there's no new training, because obviously, with different size tractors, sometimes even that takes different level of training. So you have a basically the Swiss Army knife of the regional market.

Matthew Weitzel: 13:36

Man. That's crazy. So talk to me about, I guess you also, I mean, have you switched from lead acid to lithium? Has that taken place, or are you all still sticking with lead acid?

Unknown: 13:46

Yeah, so we, we offer lithium batteries, both in our 88 and our 89 series tractors. The majority of the tractors we sell today still are lead acid at at the choice of our customers, okay, and part of that is because we pick up the nose of the aircraft, and so we need a lot of weight in our tractor. That's what I was thinking. Yeah, so the lead acid battery is really a cost effective way to not only have a very stable, very reliable, long life power solution, but it gives you the weight you need to counterbalance the weight of the nose, weight of the aircraft. Yeah,

Matthew Weitzel: 14:25

that makes a lot of sense, but they could get potentially, a lithium Oh, absolutely. We

Unknown: 14:29

sell a ton of tractors every year to major customers with lithium batteries. And the only thing is, lithium, of course, is a little bit more expensive, and you have to add some more steel ballast to make up for the weight that you lost moving away from lead acid, but it's a matter of a little bit of cost and maybe, yeah, different infrastructure, but the advantages to the customer, of course, is reduced maintenance. Yeah, a lot of people just see it as a performance, maybe a move further into the future. I. Don't know if I should say it, but personally, I'm still a big fan of lead acid batteries for our particular application. Okay, just because I feel like they are a safe, reliable, stable source of energy that, again, kill two birds with one stone. You have the power and you have the weight. And also, from an environmental standpoint, even, and I don't know if this is in vogue to say, but lead acid batteries are way more recyclable. You know, even the development of the or the mining of the minerals that are required are not nearly as, you know,

Matthew Weitzel: 15:34

as lithium. Yeah,

Jesse Long: 15:37

and nothing against lithium. I mean, where those customers have a business case for it and want it. We are able and are providing lithium batteries for sure.

Matthew Weitzel: 15:47

So how long let's say that I'm a commercial carrier? How many pushes can I do with the 8900 throughout a day without recharging?

Unknown: 15:56

Yeah, that's a good question. So I always sort of issue. A little bit of a disclaimer, there's really a lot of different factors that impact how long your battery's going to last, right? I mean, it's not only ambient temperature, but how heavy is the aircraft you're pushing, how far do you want to push it? Is there any slope on your ramp? You know, those are all factors that are going to affect, for sure, how much drive time you have on a single charge. But I will tell you, when we first started delivering to commercial customers. Well, I'll tell you two stories. One is, we had a customer that was sort of interested in our product, but they were a little bit skeptical about battery technology, and they said, you know, our hour meter on our combustion pushback tractors turn 14 hours in a 24 hour period. How long are your batteries gonna last? And we said, you know, you'll get four to five hours of drive time out of a single charge. And they said, Yeah, see that doesn't work. When, when our hour meters turn in 14 hours? And we said, Wait a second. You know your hour meters turning basically anytime the combustion engine is running, but that has no correlation to the amount of time where you're actually driving, right? So again, just in in typical Lektro fashion, we said, Let us give you a machine, put it in your operation and see what happens. Yeah, let it prove itself out. Yeah. And what they found is that in that exact same operation, okay, where a combustion engine is turning 14 hours in a 24 hour period, the hour meter on the on the Lektro 89 only turned three to four hours. And that just is an indication of how because you think about the environmental friendliness of electricity in this sort of application, a lot of times that combustion engine tow tractor, the engine's running while the passengers are boarding Okay, while you're waiting for the tower to give you clearance to push back or whatever, whereas the actual time where the tires are actually turning is very limited. It's very limited. And so how much of the time are the tires actually turning? Well, it's the three to four hours that they found out, and they said, man, you're right. These batteries are more than capable. In fact, we started then delivering in quantity, I mean, in volumes, as customers started ordering. And there was one customer where we delivered maybe faster than they were expecting, and the airport infrastructure wasn't quite in place, and they said, well, we'll start using these things, you know. And if the battery dies before the charging infrastructure is available. We'll just, you know, pull a conventional tractor back in and and they started, and it took, it took about a week for the charges to be up and running by the airport authority, and they hadn't charged the tractor yet. So we're talking a week's worth of airline pushbacks at a major US airport, and they didn't charge. Now, that's not what I would generally recommend, yeah, just for sake of bad I mean, we tell people charge every couple days, even if your batteries don't need it, just to avoid, you know, you want to cycle your batteries. But I was encouraged. I mean, I think that's a huge anecdotal, you know, sales pitch anyway, to say, look, these things have high, high endurance, and again, your usage is less than I think a lot of people perceive.

Matthew Weitzel: 19:00

So with the push, everybody's trying to go electric. We all know that it's a it's a huge push. And so talk to me about, I guess, do you see the product just completely blowing up with this, with this push to electrification, or do you think people will still stick to what they know and go to the conventional pushback, just an electric conventional pushback? Yeah, that's a

Unknown: 19:21

good question. And we've seen customers kind of go both ways. A lot of it just depends on what their established, you know, inventory or infrastructure is kind of built around there are some state and it can vary even within a single airline from one base to another. So it's not cost effective or really justifiable, a lot of times to say, well, we're just going to throw away a bunch of equipment that we have, tow bars, conventional tractors and all that. But we do see more and more airlines maybe saying, hey, let's make this a full electric base, or let's make this a full tow bar list base, because they're just trying to manage and it makes perfect. Fiscal sense, right? Where you're you're just trying to manage training resources, you're trying to manage spare parts, inventory. So I think there will continue to be a mixture, and it'll keep our business hopefully from having too many ups and downs where people are just kind of continuing to make that gradual transition. There are some places where maybe a towbar, conventional tractor sort of application is better.

Matthew Weitzel: 20:26

Okay, so that was the next question I was gonna ask you. So what case would it have to be where a conventional tractor makes more sense, an electric conventional tractor makes more sense in Lektro like, what would have to be the climate? There not climate, as far as you know, actual climate. But, yeah, what would have to be, is it footprint like that sometimes would stop a customer from switching to a conventional that's

Unknown: 20:49

the biggest thing that I would say, Yeah, is is really, if you're needing to do long distance towing, it can be a challenge Sometimes with an electric tow, barless tractor, where generally you have either a lot of torque for your pushback operations or you have a lot of speed for your longer distance. And it can be an engineering challenge, really, to get both of those things in a single unit. So sure. So sometimes what we've seen customers do is have a conventional tractor for the longer distance where they can just hook up and and blaze and, and they'll use a Lektro solution for their pushback operations.

Matthew Weitzel: 21:29

Yeah, yeah, that makes sense. So I had a customer that we were actually it was just 8925 what, BD, or something like that. Okay. Do you remember that, that whole situation? It's a higher speed model. It is a higher speed model, yeah. And you'll, I don't think you all made a ton of these things. And so they wanted to put it into a colder weather climate, and they didn't think it would work. Now, I've heard that from many different sources that that's not an issue at all, but I wanted you to, like, address like, I mean, how does Lektro work in colder climates. Yeah, so

Unknown: 22:01

there's a couple things I think that people mainly have in mind. One is the temperature impact on the batteries, and the other is the traction implications. Right? I would say that I think lead acid is probably a better solution than even lithium in a cold weather application. Going back to my lead acid preference, as far as general concerns, though, related to traction, I guess I would put it this way. Let's just say a commercial operator is needing to move a 737, the ballast that's required to safely operate that tractor in a low traction environment is, is, you know, significant it goes up, right? Because, okay, now I'm not pushing on dry, flat asphalt anymore, and that all needs to be taken into account. But what we've seen over and over again is, is when you transfer all the nose weight of the aircraft, which, in the case of a 737, or an A 320 can be 20,000 pounds or more worth of weight getting directly transferred over the drive axle of our tow vehicle. So now you have not only the weight of the vehicle, which is significant, but then you have those 20,000 plus pounds of weight added directly over your drive axle. Traction is is basically a non issue. I mean, we see time and time again our two wheel drive drive tractors outperforming four wheel drive conventional tractors, just because it's an unfair advantage. You know, we have all that nose weight being our friend, essentially, you know, whereas it's the competition against a conventional tractor. And obviously, you know, here at Oshkosh Aerotek, we sell both conventional tractors and we sell toys tractors. And like I said before, there's validity for both just in different operations. And that's what we're proud of, is being able to address the uniqueness of a wide variety of different customer applications.

Matthew Weitzel: 23:51

All right. Well, you just said wide so I'm gonna ask you the question, are we gonna see an Lektro wide body?

Unknown: 23:58

Pushback, yeah, I hope so.

Matthew Weitzel: 24:02

I mean, you brought up the subject, yeah, yeah. I

Unknown: 24:06

I hope so, yeah, I'm pretty proud. You know, I tell people a lot of times again, I didn't go to school for sales, I didn't go to school for business or even for aviation, but I enjoy my job. I love this industry, and I love the Lektro product line. Okay? So nothing would make me happier than to see us continue to be able to expand and make the product line even more successful. That being said, I do have a little caution, I guess, about trying to do everything and then and end up not doing anything well, and I think that's been one strong trademark of the Lektro product line, up until today, where, okay, when we do things, we do it right, and we do it well. And there's even, from a business standpoint, you know, the vast majority, in terms of quantities of aircraft being sold today, the vast majority are under. Body aircraft, and so we serve that that segment all the way from the narrow body airliners down through the trainer aircraft on in the general aviation segment. So I think we're well well positioned right now. And you have to kind of ask, okay, are we going to start playing in a sandbox that maybe just isn't our area of expertise? If we do a wide body we'll make sure it's good, and I certainly hope that day comes I still know when it'll be Yeah. Okay,

Matthew Weitzel: 25:25

all right. And then I would like you to kind of go over what the difference between a tow barless tractor from maybe another provider, how it differs from what you provide, because I think there's a definite difference, especially in the cradling process. And can you just kind of explain that? And I think it's less maintenance with Lektro I would imagine. Yeah, so

Unknown: 25:44

an emphasis on the Lektro product line from the very beginning has been to basically keep the machine simple, easy to work on, easy to operate, highly, highly reliable. And, yeah, I don't think it's any secret there have been and there continue to be more and more competitors, sort of envious of, you know, what we offer, and sort of wanting to pursue that same, you know, customer base, that same concept. And it seems like the competitive vehicles that come out just get to look more and more like what we have. You know, they're just getting closer and closer to building what we offer. So I guess I feel like where we distinguish ourselves is being the original. First of all, where a photocopy is never quite as good. But beyond that, I think it's the culture of lektro. It's the culture of, you know, even when we were acquired by JB tierrotech and now being folded up under the Oshkosh umbrellas, Oshkosh Aerotek. The culture of all these organizations, and this is why I still work for this company, is because the culture is build quality and then support it unquestioningly 100% so that's I couldn't sell. I don't think I'd be a salesperson if I didn't believe in the product that I'm selling, and essentially have a product that sells itself, where I can go to any trade show in the world and look customers in the face and with clear eyes tell them we will take care of you if your machine ever goes down, even if it's not. You know, you have component failures. You know nobody sees the motor manufacturer when the motor goes down, you know, it's, it's, it's Lektro whatever, and but, but we stand behind it, we always have, and I, and I'm pretty proud of that, so I think that's really a big distinguish. Distinguishing mark is, buy whatever you want, but I think we'd have a more robust testing program. I think we hold ourselves to a higher standard in terms of vehicle performance, and I think we take better care of our customers.

Matthew Weitzel: 27:47

Okay, that is not the way that I was thinking about going, but I'd love it. And I was wanted to talk about the cradling system, yeah, so can you No, but I mean, listen, that was, that was amazing, and you're exactly right. And those are all the things that I've heard. And I'm around Oshkosh all the time. We're recording it at Oshkosh right now. So, but yeah, talk to me about the cradling system and how that differs.

Unknown: 28:09

Yeah, so our system is a little bit different in that most tow barless tractors, especially in the commercial airline segment, actually clamp onto the tires rather than just pulling the nose gear onto more of a shovel or a cradle or scoop at the capture end of the vehicle. And that is a big differentiator, just because of the simplicity in terms of maintenance. You know, there's a lot fewer sensors. There's a lot fewer, well,

Matthew Weitzel: 28:38

there's just so many more things that could not go wrong Exactly, and

Unknown: 28:41

that's what you see, where you have all these clamping arms and brackets and mechanisms where one thing throws an error, even if it's a loose connection and it's not really an error, it will stop a competitive tractor and lead to delays for the customer. And in an airline application, that's a big deal.

Matthew Weitzel: 28:59

It is a big deal. It makes it so you kind of feel like you do have to have that conventional sitting around just in case. Yeah.

Unknown: 29:05

So, so the reliability and the simplicity and the universality, you know? I mean, if you talk in the general aviation segment now, having a cradle like ours, where you can put a single nose wheel, a small Lear jet or citation on the exact same cradle where you put a Boeing 737, that's definitely unique.

Matthew Weitzel: 29:24

That is unique, yeah, for sure, yeah. Okay, well, thanks for covering that with me. So, all right, I think it's time. So why don't you and then we'll kind of, we'll kind of dive into more, into more Lektro stuff. But why don't you dive into a story that you have about the industry? Yeah?

Unknown: 29:43

That's a good question. The one story that comes to mind, and I don't know if this is where you wanted me to go, necessarily, but it can go anywhere. Okay, so you know, okay, I guess I'll go back to Lektro history, maybe a little bit. And just because this is really intriguing to me, back. In the 40s, 50s, whatever. On the north coast of Oregon, there was actually some mink industry. And this is just an example of kind of where Lektro came from. Okay, so these mink farmers had come to Eric Paulson's father wilt, who owned and ran the company at the time, and said, you know, as they're trying to just increase profitability, they would build these stacked cages. And then they had come up with kind of a tractor that would drive down the rows of mink cages with conveyor belts to drop the feed into the troughs for these mink as so you can just do mass breeding, mass feeding, you know, all that stuff. And again, just maximize profitability. Well, what happened was the vehicle that they originally developed was a combustion engine tractor that would sort of tow this apparatus down the row and drop feed with conveyor belts into the mink cages. But the noise of this combustion engine driving through these barns and the feed houses or whatever, just freaked the animals out so much that they were actually eating their young. Which whole was counterproductive, right to their whole business? Yeah, I think so. So that was when they came to wilt and said, Look, we need a nice, quiet, electric solution to be able to drive. So he made a mink feeder, okay, which had this conveyor belt system would drop feed into these cages as it drove down these rows, nice and quiet. Super innovative, you know, met the customer's needs and all that. But then you have to ask, okay, when you look at it now, from a business perspective, how many mink farms are there right in the world, not just in the state of Oregon, you know. And so, okay, we have this great product, not much to do with it. Well, when, when wilt was approached, then in 1966 67 for an aircraft tow tractor, they took the mink feeder and they just turned it around, put a shovel on the front of it, and that was the first airporter that they ever built in 1967 so I love that story, just because I think of the innovation of sort of the unconventional roots of all this stuff, and really what it's led to today, not only in terms of the amazing footprint that the Lektro product line has around the world, but that now there's even companies trying to copycat or mimic what we do. And I think that's pretty, pretty remarkable.

Matthew Weitzel: 32:24

That is a great story. Yeah, I didn't think it was going to go in the mink direction before you started the story, but it did so. So talk to me about then, I guess, JBT, and then Oshkosh and and, you know, you all being acquired by JBT, and then eventually Oshkosh acquiring JBT. And, yeah, that's kind of changed lektro for the good, I

Unknown: 32:46

guess, yeah, absolutely no. And obviously, I mean, you go through acquisitions like that, and I think there's, it's, it's natural to have some apprehensions. Not really know where are things going. But it really couldn't be better on on both fronts, in, in my humble opinion, I mean, as a personal friend of of Eric's, actually, I was with him all last week in Palm Springs, just on vacation. And so we're still, we still keep in touch. But I guess what makes me so happy is to see him be so successful and allow him now to have a break after literal like, five decades, he was running this company seven days a week, and now, I guess I I just consider it our, or my, maybe responsibility, to maintain that legacy of customer first and building quality equipment and really just growing growing the business. So that's what was encouraging to me when, when we were then acquired by JBT. You know, you have these different apprehensions, but then you see that really their culture of taking care of the customer, of doing the right thing, you know, having integrity, building quality equipment, all of those things, just on a larger scale. Yeah, right. So then, you know, you fasted that that acquisition happened. 2019 allowed Eric to retire, so those of us that he left behind, you know, were kind of increasing our responsibility trying to keep this thing going. It was so providential, though I talked about the benefits of just the culture or the the synergy of cultures, you know, that were melded at that point, but really, it was providential in terms of timing too, with covid happening, and it would have been a nightmare as a privately held company to Navigate covid. Oh, right, sure. So the the sale happened in 2019 Eric stayed on board for a year, and his last day was March 30 of 2020, which is almost a date that will live in infamy for all of us, right, just because that was when things really started shutting down, major, major impact due to covid. But to have a corporation, a major corporation, behind us, to allow us to sort of navigate that, to know where we had to make cuts or where just financial. Be able to navigate those rough waters, was providential. But I think I can say now, maybe with JBT primarily being a food processing equipment company, you know, the match maybe wasn't perfect. It was in terms of us being a part of Aerotech, but yeah, for sure. Now Aerotech, you know, just needed a company behind them that was interested in additional growth and development, and so now the entire Aerotech group having been acquired by Oshkosh Corporation, in all honesty, I could not be more excited. I just think it will continue to grow and refine not only who we are, but the products that we offer, and it's remarkable. I mean, when you sit in some of these transition meetings, the things that Aerotech as a as a group are looking to expand into, or, you know, to improve, things like automation, things like telematics, things like alternative fuels, those are all the same things that now our parent company are also interested in Oshkosh. Every every product line they have is a highly engineered, purpose built piece of equipment for a tough job intro in a variety of industries. Yeah, and it's what Aerotech does. It's what Lektro does. And I just think the fit is remarkable. We already are seeing the benefits of the synergies, and it's it's only going to increase as we get more integrated with with Oshkosh, as Oshkosh Aerotek. So I'm excited. Yeah,

Matthew Weitzel: 36:39

you should be. It seems like a spectacular company that you'll now get to be a part of and reap all the benefits. So What haven't we covered? Yeah, well, I

Unknown: 36:49

guess I I think we've talked a lot about Lektro I'll say, thanks for having me. I've honored by every chance I've had to work with exceed. You guys have leased some of our equipment out, even specific to the Lektro product line. Oh, for sure. Yeah. And yeah, I'm excited to see how we can grow. I mean, I guess maybe I should be asking you, How do you think we can help exceeds business expand? What's, what's your visions for the future? And I guess I just appreciate the partnership. Yeah, well, that we have and look forward. But first, let

Matthew Weitzel: 37:21

me say that I'm a big fan of Lektro. I believe that there's going to be a lot of growth in this sector, especially with the with the conversion to electric. I feel like people are going to almost start moving away from the conventional electric pushback and kind of going into the Lektro product line. And I think that's going to be really interesting for you all. I think we want to be a part of that. Exceed has really invested in electric, in the in because we see, we see what's going on in the industry. So we're already starting to buy electric C fifteens. You know, we're buying the electric B 80 from from Oshkosh now. And we need to start buying some Lektros and getting those out into the out into the world. And, you know, it's a great, it'd be a great product for people to try, if they haven't tried it yet. So then we can, you know, offer them rentals and leases on that to see how it works. And then those people that are worried about the weather conditions and all these different things that we talked about proving it, you know firsthand that obviously it can do it right, and kind of getting that, that product out there, because it is, I mean, it also is a heck of a lot less maintenance, because there's just so many less moving parts exactly right with Lektro than there would be in a conventional pushback. So I think that there's, you all have a lot of advantages right now, and then, you know, with the power of Oshkosh behind you as well in the level of service. And I'm sure parts are easier to get. And I mean, everything's got to be better now that you're owned by such a large entity that is focused on service. So So anyway, again, believe in the product, and I think it's great. And yeah, we do. We do have some out in the field. We just don't have enough, and we need to be ordering some. And speaking of which, what is your lead time now? Because I've heard some things, and I want to make sure, like, I mean, because it

Unknown: 39:08

seems like you all are very busy, yeah, no, we have, we have a very, very healthy backlog, I will say that. But we have been working for the last year, plus, really, to not only increase capacity, but to put more pressure on our suppliers, to increase what and Oshkosh has helped with that, you know, I mean, where, oh, I may be a small fish. They use a lot of the same suppliers, and so to be able to turn up the heat on those people as now, being part of Oshkosh has been a big help, yeah, so we've heard about that, yeah. And we've seen our lead times cut in half, in some cases now, yeah, because the Oshkosh comes knocking on the door, all of a sudden the lead times on parts get a little bit shorter. Yeah, we get a little bit higher priority. Yeah, yeah. I used to be in purchasing. I know a little bit about that, yeah, yeah. You got to take care of your big customers, no. So even, even our throughput, I mean, it's, it's getting faster, lead times are definitely coming. Down significantly lead times, depending on the on the specific model that a customer needs, is anywhere from three to 10 months. And we're really just trying to be smart about it. Build some generic spec models here and there. Okay, some white tails and stuff like that. Yeah. And it's really where, you know, some of our customers, or partners like Xcēd, come into play. You know, when we can refer them to, okay, your tractor might not be ready for eight months, but we know people who have some and use this one until you get the next one. And I think it's real critical too, as we partner with companies like Xcēd, you know, we have a unit that's on its way to Louisville for the derby right now. Oh, you know, there's all sorts of events like that, whether it's the masters or the Derby, or f1 or whatever else where there's money to be made, I think, and and Super Bowl, I guess, would be another one, but in any case, yeah, I'm just excited. It's fun industry. There's a lot of diversity, a lot of interesting opportunities. You get to meet great people. And there's really not anybody in the industry that doesn't seem to love the smell of avgas, you know, and love jet fuel, yeah. So it's fun.

Matthew Weitzel: 41:10

So are you going to be at the GHI America show in Toronto? I'm

Unknown: 41:15

not currently planning to be there. I will be in Lisbon for the GSE Expo.

Matthew Weitzel: 41:18

Okay, are you all going to bring product to the GSE Europe, absolutely.

Unknown: 41:22

Yeah, we'll have a number of different products. Our new Lektro 88 i By the way,

Matthew Weitzel: 41:28

so tell me about, can we? Can we talk about, I guess that's the thing

Unknown: 41:31

we haven't spent a lot of time talking about, is new product development. Segue, yeah, I mentioned just our desire to build products that were simple and reliable. But what happens is, as technology moves forward, we want to take those advancements and and it's always the challenge of of finding the balance. Do you do you keep yourself at the cutting edge of technology and then risk, you know, having some some issues here and there out in the field? Or do you kind of hold back a little bit and make sure that new technologies are really mature, so that you're providing, when you do launch those new products, you're really providing a more reliable, mature type of technology that makes sense product. So I feel like we've struck a healthy balance in those regards, and JBT and now Oshkosh, I think have the same approach. You can't afford to do a bunch of R and D with a scheduled airline at the gate. Okay? Reliability is very, very important. So we're now at the point where we're saying, and it started when we were acquired by by JBT, and now it's continuing full speed ahead, with the refinement of our different product lines to say, where should we be integrating PLCs? Where can we transition from DC drive motors to more efficient AC drive motors, lithium batteries? You know, what can we do in terms of integrating telematics and autonomy and things like that? So that's what is wrapped up in the L 88 or the Lektro88 model, and the Lektro 89 Lektro 88 i is what we're referring to it as, and then the Lektro 89 I basically maintaining the same aircraft capacity. So it's really a direct replacement for customers who have bought our older 8850s or 8950s but just the enhancements in terms of technology and user friendly maintainer friendly features is remarkable. We're really excited. So we're going to have an 88 i at the GSE Expo in Lisbon later this year, and look to get the 89 I through some testing, and hopefully for a launch in in 2025, so real, real exciting.

Matthew Weitzel: 43:45

So Will those come with IOPS? Yeah,

Unknown: 43:48

so they'll have telemetry basically as a standard, standard feature.

Matthew Weitzel: 43:52

Right now, I'm sorry to interrupt you. So right now, can you get IOPS on, on any Lektro that you get, or is that? Yeah,

Unknown: 44:00

it's available to a limited extent, only because the amount of information that you can pull off of a relay technology type vehicle is real limited. So it's really something that's more being

Matthew Weitzel: 44:16

models, okay, all right, gotcha, yeah, well, that'll be, that'll be a lot of fun for people that get to go to the show and be able to check out the ADA die for sure, absolutely, yeah, right, yeah. We're excited. And then these units, can you get cabs on Lektros?

Unknown: 44:33

Yeah? So we've had some customers put their own cabs on and cabs aren't real friendly for our stand up models, just the dynamics, okay, but yeah, all of our sit down tractors, both the 88 as well as the 89 have had cabs available for years and years, okay, yeah, and again, more and more customers are buying them. Of course, you know, as you get in cold weather, climates move over to Europe, they're more used to some of those situations. Of course. And I don't want to inappropriately keep kind of diverting to the general aviation segment, but with that being one of my major areas of responsibility, you know, when you think of in Hangar maneuvering and tight operation areas, some people actually see the cab as a disadvantage, you know, just because aircraft strike may be more likely and things like that. Yeah, and on some of the large business jets, the Global Express aircraft and golf streams when you disconnect the torque links, which you do when you're towing that nose gear, and I don't know if people know, has literally 360 degree radial freedom. So we can capture that nose gear, spin our tractor all the way around and basically push the aircraft into the hangar sitting below the fuselage, if you can picture that. And so in terms of really maximizing the space in a hanger, I mean, you just think about being able to push the nose of your aircraft with literally zero protrusion from the tow bar or the tow tractor in front of the aircraft, and you can push the nose of the aircraft right into the corner of the hangar. And we've had some customers say, man, I've already paid for my Lektro unit because I can fit one more aircraft in my hangar than I could before, and hang Ridge, especially in harsh climate environments, whether it be cold weather or hot weather, is gold for some of these operators. So

Matthew Weitzel: 46:19

yeah, I had a small FBO basically say the exact same thing to me. They ended up leasing Lektro from us for their small little, you know, FBO and and they had the same thing where they they, they were using some old Clark tractor just to get it into the hangar. But then they realized, like, how much they're wasting as far as space goes. Because, like, to your point, Lektro can, you know, fit it on a dime? Yeah, yeah.

Unknown: 46:43

It's very maneuverable. And even being able to then get the tractor out, you know, people can drive under the wings and whatever else, which, again, just going down the road of the cabs, like you asked. I mean, people see that as maybe less than ideal for that sort of application, but we certainly offer it for the applications where people are doing exclusive, you know, pushback or longer distance towing operations. So, yeah, I appreciate the question, yeah, all right, what

Matthew Weitzel: 47:09

else do we have?

Unknown: 47:10

I think we covered it. I'm, I'm excited. I'm excited to, hopefully I'll probably see you in in Lisbon, I

Matthew Weitzel: 47:15

suppose. Huh? We Well, we're trying to figure that out at the moment, so whether Xcēd will be there. So we'll have to, we'll have to wait and see. I have not, not signed any paperwork yet, but I hope to be there. And then we're going to be doing a podcast about the upcoming GHI conference in Toronto. And then we're going to also be doing one about about the GSE Europe show, just kind of previews and stuff like that

Unknown: 47:37

well. And we will definitely have people at GHI. It just won't be me personally, probably. So, so you'll, you'll see Oshkosh Aerotek people there, for sure. Yeah, we're

Matthew Weitzel: 47:45

gonna have Josh Parkin from Oshkosh on stage. We're doing a live panel the GHI America show about electrification in the industry. So I'm sure Lektro will be brought up during that discussion. For sure. Yeah, excellent. Yeah. So, and then we're gonna have some, you know, just people talking about just infrastructure in general, as far as, like, at the airports. And then we're gonna have some, you know, talking about chargers. And we're gonna try to cover the whole, the whole thing on stage, so we'll see. Oh, that'll be fun. Yeah, excellent, yeah. But I appreciate the time today, and I'm so glad that you could come on. I've wanted to talk to you for a really long time. Glad that you were able to come down to Orlando, so that way I didn't have to go the whole way to Warren No, happy

Unknown: 48:25

to be here. But listen, you need to make a trip to Warrenton one of these days, and we'd look forward to hosting

Matthew Weitzel: 48:29

you. I do, I do. I want to come see the facility, and it would be, it would be a great time. So y'all to take me out to some of your favorite local spots there. Yep, awesome. Well, thank you so much. I appreciate it. All right. Thanks. Bye. You. Music. Thank you for tuning in to this episode of the GSE podcast. We hope you found it informative and engaging. If this episode resonated with you, please share it with your colleagues and peers in the ground support equipment community. Your support is invaluable to us. We'd appreciate it if you could take a moment to rate and review our podcast. Your feedback not only encourages us, but also helps expand our reach within the GSE community. Keep an eye out for more episodes as we continue to explore the dynamic world of ground operations. Bring you the latest trends, insights and stories from the industry. Thank you for listening to the GSE podcast until we meet again, stay grounded and keep pushing forward. You.